[Dionna]

Help! How would you grammar/punctuation pros punctuate these type of sentences? They sound fine when read aloud, but I am unsure how to punctuate them. I could make simpler sentences, but I'm trying to give a one-breath moment to the character's thoughts.

I try to reach Peter to bop him, but before I know it he’s running up a long, twisty flight of stairs with broken rungs.


I'm so mad at Peter that even when Mr. Smith hands out music for the parade and Peter's in the band room saying “Sarah, look!” because he's making silly faces at me, I'm refusing to look.
 

[David Wright Posts: 407 Status: Offline "I'm weared out"]

Assuming no word changes, I think the punctuation is fine.
[I would delete the 'at me' in the second line because it's redundant]

I am a little confused why stairs have rungs though.

[dewsanddamps Posts: 3,686 Status: Offline]

Dionna, every time I chime in on one of these threads, it turns out I'm wrong.  So take my advice with considerable caution.

But I think your first sentence is fine.

I agree with David about "rungs." Steps for stairs, rungs for ladders, right?

You might consider switching the order of the last clauses in your second sentence. "I'm so mad at Peter than even when Mr. Smith hands out music for the parade and Peter's in the band room saying, 'Sarah, look!' I refuse to look, because he's making silly faces at me."

[Kell Posts: 1,849 Status: Offline On the other hand WWW]

 I might break up that second sentence and switch the order of the clause, but differently than Katie.

I'm so mad at Peter. Even when Mr. Smith hands out music for the parade and Peter's in the band room making silly faces and saying “Sarah, look!” I refuse to look.

Then again, do you need "I'm so mad at Peter"? I think you don't.
 

[Pons Posts: 3,925 Status: Offline]

    Just want to say the part of a step you put your foot on is called a tread. I don't know how technical you want to be. "Step" would also work.

[andracill Posts: 6,836 Status: Offline Worlds within...screaming to get out! WWW]

I try to reach Peter to bop him, but before I know it(,) he’s running up a long, twisty flight of stairs with broken rungs.


I'm so mad at Peter(,) (so) that even when Mr. Smith hands out music for the parade and Peter's in the band room saying(,) “Sarah, look!” because he's making silly faces at me, I'm refusing to look.
 

Technically speaking, you need the commas I put in (but they always say the rules are there to be broken). I moved the *so* to more easily punctuate it.

[Dionna]

Man, oh man, y'all rock my socks! I wish I had a critique group with all of you included. (Nobody ever wants me. :sadcry)

I have so many sentences like this that I puzzle over. I put commas in. I take them out. I use double dashes. I try parenthesis. I break them up. Move phrases around....Sometimes, I just delete the whole thing! By the time I'm done, I forget what I'm trying to accomplish! And this for an entire novel!!! AHHHH!

Thanks so much for the clarity.  I didn't even realize "rung" was wrong. I have to go look up the word for those thingies that go between the banister and the stair, part of the railing, I think?

THANKS!

[Kell Posts: 1,849 Status: Offline On the other hand WWW]

Those are spindles or balusters, Dionna

[Dionna]

Just found it under a Google search under "anatomy of a staircase"! Thanks, Kell!

[Barbara Etlin Posts: 2,605 Status: Offline WWW]

Here's how I'd punctuate it.

I try to reach Peter to bop him; but, before I know it, he’s running up a long twisty flight of stairs with broken treads.

I changed the comma to a semi-colon after the first principle clause. I eliminated the comma between the two adjectives. Although it is correct to use it, I think the sentence reads more clearly without it.

In the second example, I'd add a comma after "that."

[Dionna]

Barbara, this is how I'll punctuate it, w/ a comma instead of the semicolon. I've heard that no semi colons should be used in children's lit. Have you ever heard that? It's a very annoying thing to avoid, esp. when it comes to tricky lists than can be easily clarified w/ semi-colons.

[Barbara Etlin Posts: 2,605 Status: Offline WWW]

Dionna, you're right. You should probably avoid semi-colons in fiction to avoid looking too academic. I'm taking back my advice. 

[Marissa Doyle Posts: 4,759 Status: Offline Charles Bewitched: out now! WWW]

I've heard that no semi colons should be used in children's lit.

Um, if kids never see semi-colons in the books they read, then how will they know anything about their proper use? Leaving them out for a reason like that just seems kind of...dumb. I have to wonder why some people dislike them so intensely.

[Lill Posts: 901 Status: Offline]

I reach out to bop Peter, but he's already running up the rickety, twisty staircase with the missing spindles.

I think the second sentence needs broken up and rewritten. It could be two or three. Hard to tell without seeing it in context with surrounding sentences.

And if you need a crit partner or reader, PM me. With two teens (one of whom I homeschool), three dogs, two cats, an elderly father-in-law, and a busy freelance schedule, I don't have time for a formal critique group. But I'm always looking for people to regularly swap with.

[Lill Posts: 901 Status: Offline]

I also like rickety, twisty, spindle-less staircase --- which skews your meaning a bit, but gives you a cleaner sentence with a fun rhythm.

[Pons Posts: 3,925 Status: Offline]

Um, if kids never see semi-colons in the books they read, then how will they know anything about their proper use? Leaving them out for a reason like that just seems kind of...dumb. I have to wonder why some people dislike them so intensely.

   I think adults don't like semi-colons and colons because they saw so few of them growing up, and now they don't know what to do with them. And I have seen several colons and semi-colons in the MG books I've been reading lately.

[Vijaya Posts: 9,201 Status: Offline LISTEN. Let all mortal flesh keep silence ... WWW]

I have so many sentences like this that I puzzle over. I put commas in. I take them out. I use double dashes. I try parenthesis. I break them up. Move phrases around....Sometimes, I just delete the whole thing! By the time I'm done, I forget what I'm trying to accomplish! And this for an entire novel!!! AHHHH!
 

You're in good company. Oscar Wilde said, This morning I took out a comma and this afternoon I put it back in again.

Vijaya

[Pons Posts: 3,925 Status: Offline]

 

[mrh Posts: 5,415 Status: Offline www.marciahoehne.com WWW]

I've heard that no semi colons should be used in children's lit.

I see them regularly, in almost every MG novel I read. If you need 'em, use 'em. 

[Dionna]

Um, if kids never see semi-colons in the books they read, then how will they know anything about their proper use? Leaving them out for a reason like that just seems kind of...dumb. I have to wonder why some people dislike them so intensely.

I agree! But every kidlit editor has told me to take them out--parenthesis, too! Most don't even like the double dash!

(Commas are so overrated!)

[Dionna]

I see them regularly, in almost every MG novel I read. If you need 'em, use 'em. 

It's nice to know they're back in style! So I guess the kidlit grammar police won't arrest my sentences, if I do?

[Dionna]

I reach out to bop Peter, but he's already running up the rickety, twisty staircase with the missing spindles.

That's much better. Now I will go and analyze both sentences to determine why that was so hard for me to figure out!

And if you need a crit partner or reader, PM me. With two teens (one of whom I homeschool), three dogs, two cats, an elderly father-in-law, and a busy freelance schedule, I don't have time for a formal critique group. But I'm always looking for people to regularly swap with.

Really?????? 

Swapping is the next best thing!

[Dionna]

You're in good company. Oscar Wilde said, This morning I took out a comma and this afternoon I put it back in again.

Vijaya

 
Was it Oscar Wilde who had an ongoing tiff with his copy editor over using prepositions at the end of a sentence????

[Pons Posts: 3,925 Status: Offline]

I don't know about Oscar Wilde and his copy editor, but there's nothing wrong with a preposition at the end of a sentence either.

[Lill Posts: 901 Status: Offline]

Really?????? 

Swapping is the next best thing!

Really. I PMed you. Swapping works best for me.

[Debbie Vilardi Posts: 5,992 Status: Offline Language is so cool! WWW]

As far as I know, that's not an accepted use of the semi colon. Gold star to Andracil for her edits.

I do think the second sentence could be split into two also, but this is how I'd write it if it were staying together.

The semi colon has limited uses. It does not belong in front of a coordinating conjunction. You can use it if you remove the conjunction though. Google semi colon usage for more.

[Dionna]

The semi colon has limited uses. It does not belong in front of a coordinating conjunction. You can use it if you remove the conjunction though.

I thought a semi-colon could be used before a coordinating conjunction; however, it's been a while since I've looked it up. 

[Arona Posts: 652 Status: Offline The house didn't fall on me. It fell on my sister.]

It was Kurt Vonnegut's opinion that semi-colons reflect weak writing. Gads, people have strong thoughts about that little devil. The semi-colon that is...well, about Vonnegut, too, I suppose.

In the work environment, I've noticed that folks who grew up in the fifties will often use it differently than those who grew up in the sixties. I was taught it joins two separate thoughts that aren't complete sentences but are related. I can't explain the rule behind the use I've seen from those from the fifties so here's an example: Enjoy the good weather; while you still can.

Not saying everyone from the fifties or sixties were all taught differently and all use it differently. It's just something I've seen enough of to know something happened somewhere.

[Dionna]

Very interesting, Arona! I've never seen the semi-colon used like that, but it makes sense to me!

[Debbie Vilardi Posts: 5,992 Status: Offline Language is so cool! WWW]

I thought a semi-colon could be used before a coordinating conjunction; however, it's been a while since I've looked it up. 

However isn't a coordinating conjunction, but your use of the semi colon is correct. http://www.chompchomp.com/terms/coordinatingconjunction.htm. Here's the list of subordinating conjunctions and their use too: https://owl.english.purdue.edu/engagement/2/1/37/