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Ug!  I've had this critique before--But not sure what I am doing wrong. My widow/orphan is off and the "Don't add space between paragraphs of the same style," is checked. Maybe I am not reading this critique correctly? I have no breaks in my novel except the chapter headings. There are no ***** between paragraphs to denote time change or scene change of even setting change. So what does the following mean?

"You should not force breaks within a scene or chapter. And you should use page breaks – the actual word processor-controlled breaks – between chapters, so that if something gets shifted, it does not mess up your whole formatting as a result. Word processors are your tools, like a painter uses a paint brush. You should learn how to use it well. Master it."
#1 - August 03, 2016, 06:55 PM

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I'm not sure what they mean by not forcing breaks within a scene or chapter, but as for page breaks between chapters, I agree. At the end of a chapter you should go to Insert and click insert page break. That way all chapter headings start on the top of the next page and as your critiquer says, the formatting stays constant.
#2 - August 03, 2016, 07:03 PM
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Oh. I do it manually.
Space
-space
-space
Chapter (Whic I space bar to the center of the page) and then Space
and start my next chapter.
Do you think because I am doing this manually that it is not holding secure when I submit through email? And comes out wonky on the other end?
#3 - August 03, 2016, 07:07 PM

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Short answer--yes. :) Do what Arty suggests re Insert > page break

#4 - August 03, 2016, 07:26 PM
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Okay--Thanks guys-
#5 - August 03, 2016, 07:28 PM

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Page breaks are stationary. If you insert a page break the page break will always be where you put it. If you just add extra spaces in manually, your formatting will shift and your chapter headers may end up in odd places.
#6 - August 03, 2016, 08:11 PM
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Oh, also do not use the space bar to center your heading. On the home menu are little alignment buttons for align left, align center, align right, and justified. 

Learning how to use these functions will make your life easier, and if you sell a ms it will make life easier for the publishing team.
#7 - August 03, 2016, 08:15 PM
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Where can I go to learn about this? UTUBE?
#8 - August 04, 2016, 12:11 AM

YouTube does have a lot of tutorials. Some writing blogs describe formatting/formatting problems. There are also lots of forums (Microsoft Community, for one).

There are usually more ways than one to do something, so you'll encounter that, but some folks, I think, like to make it seem overly complicated by listing 15 steps to do something that really takes two or three.

I'd start with YouTube.

Whatever I know, I had to teach myself. I found YouTube the best place to start.

P.S.: I don't know if it's due to system updates or what, but quite often when someone would show/list steps, my computer didn't have the field/command/option/etc. they said to use in a step. I just kept playing with my computer and poking around online. Ugh.

Best wishes.  :star2

#9 - August 04, 2016, 04:10 AM
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Arona-
Thanks! This side of the process is not something I embrace easily. Which is why I'm still space barring my headings, etc. Thanks for the help. I suppose there might be a Word for summies from the library, too.
#10 - August 04, 2016, 06:28 AM

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Word  also has a Help feature built in. I usually find how to do something that way. But I still use my space bar instead of page breaks. For some reason, I'm scared of page breaks.

As far as using **** for time breaks within a chapter, I've seen them used in published books, but I've also heard it's better to write the transition to make the story flow better....that the time/scene break can be jarring to the reader. But if the scene or time change occurs with the new chapter, it sits well with the reader.

Happy writing!
#11 - August 04, 2016, 06:41 AM

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Dionna,
I have also seen the ***** in published work. Unfortunately that was not what I was doing. All my transitions are written in and each scene is complete within itself. Then onto the next chapter. The critiquer thought that the spaces between paragraphs (that seem to happen randomly when I send through email) was a transition. It was not. So I think he/she was frustrated that these large spaces were in and out of the submission.

Does anyone know if you send yourself your manuscript if you will be able to see how it looks for reals?
#12 - August 04, 2016, 07:00 AM

You can send to yourself but it's no guarantee how it will look on whatever system someone else has. If you use the tools to format (e.g., headers vs. no headers, centering instead space-barring, etc.) you have a better chance of things going through as they should--and if not, they are more easily corrected. It also will take the wonder out of the agent's head: Did she really want a break here???

I meant to ask: are you referring to HEADERS when you say page breaks?
#13 - August 04, 2016, 08:27 AM
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IN GENERAL, if you use the formatting tools in Word to make your ms look the way you want, it SHOULD look the same when sent to another person who opens it in their version of Word -- unless the versions are totally outdatedly different. (As opposed to using space bar, extra hard returns, etc.)

Another option is you can save your Word doc as a PDF and email that to someone else. Then it will look the same. However, the recipient won't be able to type edits/thoughts into the PDF the way they an in Word (obviously). So the receiver would need to specifically say a PDF was OK rather than a Word doc.

Then if you ms is acquired, you'd still have to change the formatting in the Word doc anyway...

Love technology! :-D
#14 - August 04, 2016, 08:55 AM
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This is all so so helpful, you guys. Thank you all very much!

Arona--My dfination of Header is the page number at top and Last name/Title. Chapter breaks--centered, and that was when I was just space barring to the center of the page. And that was apparently one thing that went wonky en route.

*********  These I refer to as transition/scene changes which I am not using, but I think the critiquer thought I was because of huge gaps in text--which I did not know there were huge gaps in text because when I sent it, it looked fine.

Again--thankyou all for so much help! I've a lot of research to do.    :badidea
#15 - August 04, 2016, 09:17 AM

I replied to the question with the assumption she would copy/paste into the body of an email, as is often done with PBs in a query, and then would send it whole upon request, but I shouldn't have assumed anything.  :embarrassed3
#16 - August 04, 2016, 09:21 AM
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This might have been covered all ready: a forced page breaks means--no manual space bar or return. Go to: Insert/Break/Page Break and the page will automatically break for you.
#17 - August 04, 2016, 11:26 AM

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Oh! Thanks LadySlipper. Good to know.

Arona--while I don't write PB (YA) I do sometimes cut and paste. This entry that I got the critique on was for a contest. I got marked down for my formatting. It was confusing for me because I thught I had sent it perfect. I guess I did send it perfect, but it did not arrive in the same condition.   :drinking2
#18 - August 05, 2016, 07:46 AM

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Hairaplenty--your local library probably has a copy of Microsoft Office for Dummies that'll have the info you need for your version.
#19 - August 05, 2016, 12:52 PM

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I have a question. When I want to make a page break, I always hold down Ctrl and then hit Enter. Does that have the same result as going to Insert and asking for a page break there?
#20 - August 05, 2016, 01:08 PM

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Hi EV! I just tried Ctrl / Enter but it didn't do anything on my software program. (I'm on Microsoft Word). You will know when there's a page break because it says: Page Break (in that light blue text) and then automatically scoots you down to a new page. 
#21 - August 05, 2016, 01:30 PM

SO glad I've been following this thread. To date, I haven't had to consider page breaks. If I had, I think I would have assumed that having headers on each page would address any returns at the bottom of a page.

Phew.
#22 - August 05, 2016, 02:52 PM
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Hmmm....that's interesting, LadySlipper. Maybe it's because I have an old version of Word (2003). Maybe they took out that option in later versions. I don't get the light blue text, but my cursor definitely starts on a new blank page, right after the page where I had been typing. (Or if I'm in the middle of some text when I click, it puts my cursor at the top of a new page with the remaining text below me.)

Okay, I went to Insert-->Break-->Page break, and I got exactly the same result as using my short-cut way. Still no light blue text.

I'm surprised they would take out the short-cut, because it's definitely easier.  :eh2
#23 - August 05, 2016, 06:08 PM

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Okay. I Googled it. Ctrl Enter is listed as the short cut keystroke for a page break.

It didn't say anything about it only being for old versions.
#24 - August 05, 2016, 06:12 PM

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I also remember being puzzled, then annoyed at the inconvenience of losing the keyboard shortcut for page breaks. It's not like they replaced Control + Enter with something else.
#25 - August 05, 2016, 06:39 PM

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Ev--that definitely sounds like a "forced" page break--which is good! (With or without the light blue text).
#26 - August 06, 2016, 04:35 AM

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How many of you lovely ladies are on Twitter? If so, we should Follow each other. My Twitter's on my signature--not sure I see yours except @cynmarko who I already follow. :D Cheers!
#27 - August 06, 2016, 04:38 AM

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I don't do much on Twitter but I'm happy to follow. (Just followed you LadySlipper.)

My Twitter's @evchristensen
#28 - August 06, 2016, 08:00 AM

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I'll follow you back Ev....and done!
#29 - August 06, 2016, 11:10 AM

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